Boros vs Battle Beast (One Punch Man vs Invincible)

 

“Say I am mad and give my madness rein to wreck itself; the worst that can befall is but to die an honorable death.”

  • Sophocles


Lord Boros, the Dark Matter Pirate and dominator of the universe.

VS

Battle Beast, the honorable warrior of Dornn and scourge of twin galaxies.


In the eyes of many warriors, to battle is to live. If you take away the passion of a battle, all that is left is the desire for a true one more than anything. Once they finally find it, those warriors are free, and you'll never find a soul in the universe happier than they are. So who will fufill their wish of an honorable battle with a worthy death in Media Mania.

Before We Begin

Obviously this blog will contain a large amount of spoilers for both Invincible and One Punch. so this is your one chance to back out for spoilers sake.


The media list for both is very simple


Boros will be getting the original webcomic, anime, manga, the OPM data book and OPM Compus.


Battle Beast will be getting the Invincible comics, TV show, various other pieces of Invincible Universe media, the handbook and a few select crossovers (more on them later)


Now you may ask? What about the mobile games for both? For OPM we did take some statements from these games into account as the lore of the games could be considered canon unlike the gameplay. Obviously in canon multiple Boros aren't running around with suits and other related memorabilia. But some statements could be related to lore and not break canon. This same rule applied to Invincible Guarding the Globe but GtG does have more backing for it like the fact we have a canon explanation for the clones running around. But in the end for fairness and time's sake we ended up mostly ignoring the mobile games.


As usual not everything belongs to us. All calcs go to their respective owners along with us using information from the Saitama VS Popeye G1 Blog, Respect Lord Boros, FreestyleKneepad's Respect Saitama Omni-Man VS Homelander G1 Blog, BorBurison's Battle Beast Respect Thread, Mikhailnikolaievitch's Thragg Respect Thread and Hippo's Atom Eve Analysis.

Background

Boros 

“Come. Bring stimulation to my existence! THAT IS WHY I AM HERE!”


What does it mean to be the strongest? Some stereotypical hero might say it means to protect all others. One random villain of the week would boast about how it is a symbol of their right to rule all others. No matter who says it, they all have a naive idea that being the strongest is a good thing. In reality, it is a personal hell that the alien known as Lord Boros knew all too well. 


Growing up in an incredibly harsh environment on an even more cruel planet, Boros was born to a species who had to constantly evolve to the dangers around them. As a result, they all had incredible regeneration potency, latent energy, and unmatched physical superiority, but Boros was a prodigy even by their standards. Among this power came a goal to prove it, and so he became a pirate; ravaging several planets across the universe. However, all this brought was complete and encompassing…boredom, as he grew tired of having such strength but nobody to prove it to. You can't be at the top with nobody in your ranking system after all, and so Boros grew stagnant. 


However, at the peak of his despair, he met a sagely seer, he crafted a prophecy that a being on a far-away planet would match his strength; rekindling his passion for battle. Tempted by such a prize, he traveled to Earth for decades, and once there, he unleashed armageddon on the first city he saw. Yet, like magic, a warrior boarded his ship, slaughtered his strongest warriors, and destroyed his armor in one punch. This man was Saitama, and he was exactly what Boros hoped for: A challenge like no other, to finally let loose and show all that he had worked for. Even when his strongest attacks did little, he still enjoyed the battle to its fullest, having found his passion once more. Once it had ended and he lay at Death's door, Boros could see that Saitama was just what he was; a being with strength so vast none could challenge him. As he faded away, Boros could only celebrate his foe's strength in a bittersweet farewell, and maybe hope that somewhere, someday, Saitama would find that same joy he had.

Battle Beast

“But oh, how you disappoint. Killing you is an ACT OF MERCY.”


What is the true meaning of life? For some it’s helping others, for others it’s gaining wealth and for Battle Beast it’s fighting and to be killed in a glorious death. A liberator to some, a scourge to others and a threat to all those who are strong.


Born some time ago, Thokk was born into a world of turmoil and war. He would be trained in his childhood and became a master of combat being a master in all known weapons and his Leonain physiology gives him enhanced senses and due to a curse he would be granted unlimited stamina. Thokk would bring about an unprecedented level of peace to his home world and would bring about a utopia of sorts where he was starting to gain a name for himself. Around this time Thokk would leave his planet in search of a worthy opponent where the legend of Battle Beast begins


Battle Beast would travel worlds in search of worthy opponents and someone to challenge him he would free multiple worlds and claim heads of strong warriors as prizes where he would gain an allies “Scourge of the twin galaxies”. At some point Battle Beast was informed of Earth where he would be hired as a mercenary to take on worthy opponents but found there was none to match him and would leave the planet but would put two members of the guardians of the globe in a coma and brutally injure Mark Grayson. We later see Thokk captured by Viltrumites and would assist Nolan and Allen who were also captured. He would fight several Viltrumites in this battle but would freeze in space later rescued by the Coalition of planets he would begin to work for them against the Viltrumite empire.


During this time working a battle would break out over Viltrume where he would fight several Viltrumites at once but during the battle he would see what he’s always wanted Thragg, leader of the Viltrumites over power like Nolan, Mark and Thaedus. A strong warrior and after the destruction of planet Viltrume Thokk would awaken to charge Thragg where he would be swiped and knocked aside. After the battle he would work for the Coalition saving planets where he would free a shark race where a woman would ask to mate with him which he agreed they would fall in love where then Thokk would be called and told he is required to fight Thragg. Thokk would take the challenge and find Thragg on Thraxia he would be about to fight Thragg when his mate would drop Rognarr on them after they were dealt with Thragg was disemboweled where Thokk would take his sword and cut his guts open where he would tell Thragg how he doesn’t seek a worthy foe he seeks someone who is stronger then him to give him a worthy death. Battle Beast and Thragg would fight for days their clashes matching each other using claws and teeth to fight Thragg he would puncture Thragg’s eye with his teeth and leave him near death Thokk would tragically lose the fight when Thragg would crush his heart he would thank Thragg for his death and the fight Thragg would collapse form the battle. When he awoke he would have skinned Thokk and wore him as a trophy but during this time Thokk’s mate would birth his daughter and where she would swear to get revenge for him but not knowing that the very thing he wanted had been achieved a worthy foe a worthy death and he died in sheer joy and relief he died to such a worthy foe grateful for someone who could kill the Scourge of the twin galaxies.

Abilities 

Boros

Enhanced Senses

Befitting of his experience in latent energy, Boros can sense that of his foes through just a glance at them, like when he first met Saitama.

Latent Energy

Hailing from his species' own evolution, Boros possesses latent energy on an incomprehensible scale, which all of his other abilities run on. He can use it to boost his physical prowess, utilize energy techniques, enter higher forms, and heal his wounds through focusing energy on the damaged area.

Energy Bullet

By focusing large amounts of his energy into a single laser, Boros unleashes a massive blast capable of vaporizing most foes instantly.

Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon 

When pushed to the brink, Boros can unleash this massive attack, utilizing ALL of his internal energies in the unparalleled Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon. This massive blast is the culmination of everything Boros is as a warrior, and his last stand against whatever warrior he may face.

 Regeneration 

By utilizing his latent energy to speed up the healing process, Boros can heal himself from virtually any injury. As long as there is something for Boros to regenerate from and he has the energy to do so, he can come back from any amount of damage. It can be a simple lost limb or coming back from nothing but an eye and some blood. This is because he has the best regeneration of his species, which is renowned for their regenerative abilities.

Battle Beast

Enhanced Senses 

Battle Beast can see in complete darkness and farther than 8 times what humans can. He can distinguish differences in acoustic pressure at -10 decibels along with differentiating sounds from the tiniest amount of tone. He can hear 4-5 times farther than any human. Battle Beast can also smell 14 times greater than a human and even his whiskers can detect small changes in air currents. All of this can be found here.

Unlimited Stamina 

Battle Beast was able to fight Thragg for days and was stated to have unlimited stamina. 

Arsenal

Boros

Restraining Armor

That feeling when you're so powerful you need armor that makes you weaker. All just so you don't kill your opponents too quickly.

Ship

A city sized BEHEMOTH of a spacecraft that Boros travels in. It flies and has cannons that fire large bullets capable of decimating whole cities.

Battle Beast

Sharp Teeth

Great for biting faces like it's 1987. Can tear through Viltrumite skin like it’s paper…

Mace

Battle Beast's main weapon of choice is his mace. A heavy golden weapon of pure power to slam on opponents and crush their organs.

Sword

It's a sword… what else do you want?

Shield

Good for bashing in faces and defending yourself from enemy attacks.

Hammer and Heavy Blade

Sometimes you just need a heavy blade and a hammer to get the job done. He brought these to fight Thragg in his greatest battle capable of cutting through Rognarr and his own flesh.

Various Other Weapons

Along with the maces, swords and heavy blades we already discussed, Battle Beast tends to also use cudgels and quarter staffs.

Ship

After slaughtering the crew on board Battle Beast took a ship. It seemingly has cannons to fire attacks and of course the ability to travel space. It even has an onboard AI that can talk and communicate with Battle Beast and help him. However, It's usually just used to find potential places for Battle Beast to fight at.

Teleporter

When you're scouring the universe looking for a worthy challenge It comes in handy to be able to teleport. This device let's Battle Beast open a portal between a place he wants to go and his ship to travel where the fight is at and back.

Jetpack

A perk of working with the Coalition of Planets. It's a Jetpack that lets Battle Beast fly through space. 

Forms

Boros

Unrestrained Form

After Boros's restraining armor is shattered, he can activate his true power. This increases his physical attributes like power and speed, and unleashes massive amounts of energy just through his mere presence.

Meteoric Burst

When Boros is on the back foot, he can unveil this trump card. Releasing his internal energies in vast amounts, he can activate his Meteoric Burst form, which increases his already godlike strength and speed even further to end fights as quickly as he can. Unfortunately it does drain his energy at a rapid rate, similar to anaerobic exercise, and shortens his life as a result.

Stats

Boros

Feats

  • Ravaged galaxies in search of a good battle

  • Brought out a serious blow from Saitama

  • Was deemed a Dragon level threat (or higher)

  • According to ONE, would’ve had one hell of a battle against Awakened Garou if they had the chance

Attack Potency 

Durability

Speed

Resistances

Battle Beast

Feats

  • Took his planet back from tyranny

  • Bodied the New Guardians of the Globe

  • Found a worthy death at the hands of Thragg

  • Pulled a baddie and had a daughter

Attack Potency

Durability

Speed

Resistances

Experience/Skill/IQ/Other

Boros 

While we don’t know too much about Boros’ personal backstory and training, we’re told he’s spent 20 years traveling the cosmos and battling various fighters, always coming out on top. He’s also spent those years, if not more, leading an alien army and conquering other planets, making him an effective leader. 

Battle Beast

Considering this guy is ‘cursed with rage’ it’s nobody's surprise that Battle Beast has tons of experience fighting foes. He has ended entire wars, freeing his entire planet and making it a Utopia. His skills in hunting and battle have been trained to perfection. He washed an early Invincible, forced Black Samson and Bulletproof into a coma, and fought against Thragg.


Thragg, the leader of the Viltrumite empire, was trained from birth to be the strongest one of them all. He has experience against all manner of Viltrumites. Battle Beast walked up and fought him, managing to fight him for days. While Battle Beast didn’t win, Thragg passed out from his wounds right after he beat Battle Beast. Thagg wasn’t the only Viltrumite that Battle Beast fought, he beat other Viltrumites when he was escaping from prison. 

Weaknesses 

Boros

While lacking in weaknesses such as fire, extreme cold and such. Boros will often leave himself weakened and continue fighting to show he can fight Saitama without an arm for a portion of his fight. His confidence and sheer want to fight strong foes can lead to him being reckless. Furthermore in Meteoric Burst his form will drain him of life force when he’s using it and mainly CSRC (Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon) can drain him of life force and energy when using it which can stack up.

Battle Beast

Battle Beast lacks a lot of general weaknesses aside from a couple notable ones. Battle Beast can be blinded in his pursuit of a worthy foe and be blindsided by an attack he should be capable of dodging. He is a worthy fighter and as shown with his fight against Thragg he will injure himself to put you and him on even playing field which can lead to his downfall as he’s not fighting at full capacity. As a smaller note, over time although he can breathe and fight in space he will freeze in space if he is there too long as he can’t remain there for that long before he starts to freeze. Finally, in his death with Thragg, destroying his heart will permanently end his life beyond his stamina or pain tolerance can bring him back from. 

Before We Decide…

Awesome Trailer

Shout out to Round 1 for the amazing trailer for this goated match up.

Star Level Boros Statement

In the One Punch Man Compass Boros is stated to be able to use the Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon to destroy a star. Between the name and the statement this seems pretty open and shut right? So why is this being debated?


This is because it is likely a mistranslation of the original. You see in the original Japanese guidebook we see the Kanji “星” used where star was used in the translation. The Kanji here is “Hoshi”. Hoshi does mean star but as shown in the link above and this website here, it can also be used for planets. Based on the fact that this is the only place that lists the Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon as a star buster over everywhere else calling it a planet buster, it would make more sense for the CSRC to be referring to planets in the Japanese text. We even have proof in the manga where Hoshi was used for planets when moving it over to English and was talking about the Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon. One Punch Man Compus itself is actively referring to the Anime Version as well, which had the attack at planet busting.


Overall, it seems way more likely that the Collapsing Star Roaring Cannons power is at planet level based on the one off nature of the star level statement and the many signs of a mistranslation occuring.

Boros Scaling to Tatsumaki

(Image by Yacine)

A rather intriguing debate in the One Punch Man community, and an equally interesting one in general, is the matter of how Boros compares to Tatsumaki. The Tornado Of Terror is easily one of the strongest characters in the series besides Saitama, and can move the Earth out of our solar system in a mobile game. While they have never fought, we can make some comparisons throughout the series to tell how they match up.


Starting off, Tataumaki redirects the bullets from Boros’ ship. She did this rather casually, and destroyed a large portion of it as a result. Boros on the other hand did so on a much higher scale in actual damage through the heat of his attacks. This basically means Tatsumaki's casual state should likely be inferior to Meteoric Burst Boros. 


We can also talk about Garou. In short, ONE stated Boros would be a match for Awakened Garou, and thus we can scale him off the feats Garou pulled off. This includes his ignoring a weakened Tatsumaki's power with little effort, and one-shotting Golden Sperm, who ONE also stated Tatsumaki would have defeated at normal strength in an interview with Niconico. The statement itself, despite being a little hard to translate accurately, has the phrase "万全" (meaning "ten thousand completeness") which would imply Tatsumaki at her peak would be needed to defeat him. Garou on the other hand did the same thing, so in that vein, they are comparable, and so too is Boros through ONE's statements. 

Crossover Scaling for Invincible?

Image Comics has a tendency to crossover with itself a lot. Invincible is no exception. He's been seen with Spawn, Firebreather, Savage Dragon and the Tick. So how do we handle crossovers?


Well the easiest answer and the one that makes the most sense comes from Erik Larsen. Erik Larsen lays out that when a character crosses over with another in Image, one character crosses over with a non-canon version of the other and vice versa. This is so writers aren't constrained into having to abide by rules and plots set up by other writers such as world collapsing events. Basically most crossovers wouldn't be canon and thus Invincible, Battle Beast and the rest of the cast wouldn't scale to any crossovers. This includes people like Spawn, Duncan Rosenblatt and Savage Dragon.


So this may get you asking why Tech Jacket and The Tick are part of the blog.


Tech Jacket is the easier one to explain so we will start with that. While Tech Jacket is his own comic series with its own plots, it still takes place within the Invincible universe. Because it takes place in the same universe as Invincible it would never have to be subjected to the crossover rules laid out above. This also applies to verses we didn't mention but are still in the Invincible universe like Brit.


Next is the harder to explain Tick. While Tick doesn't take place in the world of Invincible it has some extra context around it. Basically the Tick #100 is supposed to be a special case of a crossover as noted by the writers and it also shows Invincible being taken from his universe to the Ticks. This would mean it is likely canon and nor subjected to the crossover rules Erik Larsen places.


One thing you may be curious about is the moon move Invincible and the Tick pull off and its separate ends. Essentially, the yottaton end is achieved through comparing the size of the moon to Mars, determining weight through the calculation, and then getting the aforementioned number. The exaton ends are gotten through using the actual moons of Mars instead of a size calculation. This brings us to which ends are right, where it mostly depends on how you handle these kinds of feats.


The planet is clearly Mars, and is called such, so the moon they moved was one of the planet's 2 moons. The issue with taking the calculated size in this case is that it is essentially making up an entirely new moon to boost values instead of taking the much more realistic end and just using the moons the actual planet has. Unless they magically spawned an entire celestial body out of their asses (which in all fairness, would make sense for something as goofy as the Tick), the sizes would be far different, and far higher as a feat in numbers. In these sorts of feats, not all the sizes of celestial bodies are going to be 1-1 with their actual representation due to being hard to accurately draw in any consistent way. However, we do fully know the intent; that being to have them push one of Mars moons. Thus, going with their actual sizes and weight instead of a made-up moon is overall the more factual route.


Now you may be asking, what about Supreme? Well this is a lot more contentious  and has a lot more to it. So instead of just explaining it in the stats section or here we have to actually talk about it in its own section.

Supreme Scaling

To start, because we didn't put Supreme in the stat sections we first have to discuss feats that either Supreme or one of his many verison scale to. These include…


Now if you were expecting Supreme to just be star level. Have fun with this knowledge. Also some of the Suprema scans come from this respect thread. 


So why aren't we jumping at the chance to scale Omni-Man to him due to their crossover? They fight on par and its treated as a special event that started with Supreme #66? Well this is because of what we know about Supreme and his abilities. Mainly one, his adaptation. See Supreme is weird in the case that his physiology has a weird property. That property being that Supreme's body will match the power of the person he is fighting. This means that his body would only be about as strong as Omni-Man during the fight and Omni-Man wouldn't scale to that of Supreme’s high ends. It also gives an inverse explanation on how Supreme and his variants can struggle to lift up the universe but other times break through a 16D barrier.


To put it simply, while Supreme is a powerful being, scaling Omni-Man to him is really hard due to his shifting physiology.

The Higher Tier Invincible Stuff 

This segment will serve as a smorgasbord of Invincible stuff. Anything listed as “Debatable” will be talked about and discussed here. but first…

The Destruction of Viltrum

Starting with a point about Invincible stats, the destruction of Viltrum and the criticisms brought up against. The main two arguments include…


  1. It required the help of Space Racer’s Infinity Ray to destabilize the core.

  2. It took 3 Viltrumites to destroy the planet which would make higher end scaling fishy


Starting with point 1, If you thought we were done using G1 past the stats, you were mistaken. You see the G1 Blog (Major props to them) brings up a very plausible explanation for how Space Racer could have helped the destruction of Viltrum without making it weaker. Space Racers' gun was helping to make the core of the planet colder. While Viltrumites have a solid heat resistance they still can be killed under high amounts of heat. Assuming Viltrum's core is similar to the earth's, it would be up to 9392° Fahrenheit. This is higher than a Viltrumites own 6000° heat resistance.


This gives us a plausible explanation for how Space Racer helped the Omni-Man, Mark and Thaedus without damaging the core. Especially because Space Racer using his gun to damage the core wouldn't make sense because the effect was supposed to be temporary. Unless the Viltrum core can just repair and heal itself, damage to it wouldn’t just be temporary like the effects of Space Racer’s gun. In fact, because Space Racer’s gun likely couldn't destroy Viltrum on its own despite it being able to destroy stars (which is consistent with the comic), you could make an argument that Viltrum is more durable than a star. Or Space Racer didn't take out the planet himself for plot purposes, pick your poison.


Now for the second point. Hard capping the Invincible cast due to this one feat is a little silly in our opinion. Mainly because a ton of Viltrumites and even BB survived the planet's explosion and Viltrumites AP should scale to their durability. So what's the deal with that if Viltrumites can only take on planetary feats if there are 3 of them? Along with Kirkman’s own statements around a Viltrumites power by the end of the comics and the fact that we have no statements saying the bust required all 3 Viltrumites signals that 3 Viltrumites may have been overkill. Heck, Mark, Omni-Man and Thaedus come out relatively unscathed so really how much can this feat cap the higher tier feats?

The Planet Eater and E=MC^2

The next point of discussion, Planet Eater. Before we can explain the arguments for and against it we first need to discuss the key characters in the argument and how characters like Battle Beast would even scale. For starters, Planet Eater is a character who comes from the Tech Jacket comic run. In his short appearance in this comic run, he gets one shot by a character called Knull. Later in the series a bloodlusted Knull and Tech Jacket trade blows with one another meaning they should scale or at the very least, Tech Jacket downscales. In the Invincible comic series, Tech Jacket openly admits that he doesn’t think he could go toe to toe with higher level viltrumites in which Thragg, a character who Battle Beast fought for multiple days, would be.


So with the scaling chain out of the way we need to discuss the feat and what the calc for it would get. Well, Planet Eater is very similar to another character named Scavenge who is capable of turning things into raw energy to eat them. This would allow an E=MC^2 equation to be put in place. This equation would net 3 values depending on the size of planet you would use, 7.06 Quettatons, 128 Quettatons, and 1.71 FoE. The best end likely to use would be the mid end of 128 Quettatons, assuming the planets are the size of Earths. Why would this be the best assumption? Well mainly because we have no idea the size of the planets Planet Eater has consumed. We know he has consumed planets with life on it and many planets that can contain life in real life are all around the size of the Earth. Thus using the size of Earth should be the best assumption.


Now, time for the arguments for and against this feat. Before we can address the argument against the feat we first have to address the arguments for them. To begin with, both Planet Eater and Scavenge are both technological creatures in biology which means there’s a chance they both consume their energy or fuel in the same way by turning whatever they eat into pure energy first. Both creatures also exist to consume things as well as when they consume things and turn them into pure energy, they are using it to boost their strength. Now for the arguments against it. While it is true both are technological beings who consume things, there is no 1:1 correlation between the characters. There is no mention that they are of the same species or that they function in the same way, in fact their designs aren’t very similar either to even make a connection through physical means. The comparison of the two characters are very shallow as well as it basically comes down to technological beings who consume things to make themselves stronger thus they should have the same ability. As stated above, while we know how Scavenge consumes things, we don’t know Planet Eater does. There is a possibility that Planet Eater could consume the planet in other ways such as draining the planet of its resources or absorbing the materials of the planet and turning it into fuel, similarly to how the human body absorbs nutrients from food. The way you wish to interpret this comes down to if you think Planet Eater and Scavenge have enough similarities to compare the two, which is up to you to decide.

Omnipotus (And more E=MC^2) 

Fun fact, this debate was one of the driving factors that let Omni-Man VS Bardock reach the top 5 most messages in a DBD debate. Anyway Omnipotus is an Invincible villain who shows up twice throughout the story. In the Invincible handbook and the comics we are given some information about his powers and strength. This includes the power to convert destruction energy into the energy that flows through his body. This should apply for the E=MC^2 formula.


But what kind of energy is he absorbing? Well, apparently the energy of a Star System and even a universe. So let's discuss all the points for and against Omnipotus and his absorption


  1. Omnipotus's destruction of the star system and universe is poorly defined and thus can't be used.


Yes, it is true that these levels of destruction are poorly defined for sure. It comes from a handbook after all. Omnipotus's Star System destruction is defined only as a chain reaction of destruction and nothing more. This could mean that Omnipotus only sets off a chain reaction, which causes the star system and universal levels of destruction. However this point is very irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. This is because we don't need to know if Omnipotus destroyed the star system or the universe. Only that he absorbed the energy of and translated it to his power. E=MC^2 pretty much will always get higher than physical destruction anyway. This is also pretty easily confirmed by the order of events present in the handbook. To quote the actual book “His claim to have laid waste to a star system  suggests his power can initiate a chain reaction of exponentially increasing destruction” followed by “He appears to channel the cosmic energy of the matter he destroys and converts that energy into a usable source of power, which he is able to channel through his own body enabling him to utilize his reality altering abilities”. This would make the implication that Omnipotus destroyed the star system and absorbed the energy after. It's also just something in character for him to do from what we hear within the handbook as this process of destruction and absorption seems to be his M.O. Omnipotus’s destruction of the universe is even more blatant. As the claim of him destroying his universe comes right after a discussion on him using energy of destroyed matter to increase his physical and psionic attributes. We linked it in the stats section but this link has all of the Omnipotus information from the handbook and would be handy for you to look over as we move forward.


  1. Omnipotus was not at full power when fighting the heroes.


This is true, Omnipotus says himself that he was not at his full strength and needed to feed on more energy. However, during the first fight he is stated to have his “restoration nearly complete” and that he would soon be restored. Along with the guidebook saying he plans to push into new levels of power with his conquering of the Invincible universe. By the second fight he had charged himself with even more energy to make sure that he could defeat the heroes of Invincible. Even then Thragg (And by this logic Battle Beast) should likely upscale his power and make up for some of this lost power. We also have to assume that his destruction of the star system was his last peak that he was building up to, which is hard to believe when he destroyed his own dimension. With how close Omnipotus was to restoration, Battle Beast's upscaling, and the unknown limits of Omnipotus this point does not hold as much weight as one may think in our opinion.


  1. Omnipotus lies about his power as he is known for hyping himself up.


Omnipotus is indeed one to talk high and mighty, no denying that. However, most of these statements come from the handbook which has no reason to lie about Omnipotus's power. It's meant to give you lore and information about the Invincible universe, not lie to your face. While much of the text regarding his power has words such as “his claim”, they can be backed up. When it's says Omnipotus claims to have destroyed his universe this can easily be verified when looking at the section of the handbook page that says “Base of Operations”. Here it says that Omnipotus's universe was drained and destroyed by him. In regard to the star system, the writer uses it to further explain Omnipotus's power meaning he likely buys Omnipotus's claim and once again, they have no reason to lie.


  1. Omnipotus is described to “lay waste to a star system” which doesn't mean destroyed.


Sure but like, what other purpose does Omnipotus have to attack and cause massive damage if not to absorb its destruction energy. Even if he didn't he would still likely absorb the destruction energy because it feeds him even if destroying the star system itself is more likely due to what we know about his abilities and powers. This also only applies to the star system side and not the universe which was explicitly stated to be drained and destroyed by Omnipotus.


  1. Omnipotus likely caused this absorption over a timeframe which would hurt the feat.


While we can't confirm the absorption of the star system or universe happened over a large period of time we can't deny it is a fair assumption based on his own statement of requiring months of absorption to rebuild strength for his second fight. However, he did eventually absorb and consume a ton of energy. Which he was able to hold, convert and flow throughout his body completely fine. We see when he dies he releases pent up energy so clearly he was containing the huge amount of energy he absorbed within his body just fine. The final point to make here is that Omnipotus also uses this converted energy to increase his physical strength as he flows it through his body. Meaning even if it took time to absorb and convert the energy it would still be stored and powered into his physical strength.


  1. We can't confirm how much energy Omnipotus absorbed as a whole, which would hurt the feat.


Easily the best point to make against Omnipotus and his absorption. There isn't a ton of proof he does absorb ALL of the energy from the items he destroys outside of stretching what “the” means but, he is still likely absorbing a high amount. He needs to gain strength and all. If he wasn't absorbing a huge amount of energy what would the purpose of absorbing the destruction energy be? Even if Omnipotus is absorbing a small amount of energy from the star system and universe, he is still absorbing from a huge power source. Think of dividing 600 by 2 or another example. You are still gaining a large number despite not taking all of it. Let's assume that taking all the energy from both a star system and a universe only came out to the energy of a star being converted from Omnipotus. Just a low end hypothetical. Well converting the energy of a star like the sun still gets around 1787 Foe. Which is easily in the Solar System tier for a low end. To summarize this point. While a valid argument can be made for Omnipotus not absorbing all of the energy from what he destroys, he is still going to overall gain a large amount of power.


  1. Outlier lol


Can't blame you for this one. This really depends on your opinions on what you consider an outlier. But the absorption of power is a huge part of Omnipotus and the destruction of his universe is a defining trait of his so do with that what you will.


Now that we are done with our long list of rebuttals and claims for Omnipotus and his absorption, it is up to you, the reader, to make a decision if you buy his feats or not. No matter if you buy them or not these should be considered high end feats and at least taken with a grain of salt. However, we also hope you at least look at the arguments presented and see our points. Now, will you tremble at the unlimited power of Goatnipotus? Or will you not kneel to the potential man Fraudnipotus? The choice is yours.

Invincible Traveling Cosmic Distances

In some high-tier speed feats for Invincible, at one point, he outpaces a ship flying to Earth from outside their Galaxy. Seems pretty straightforward, except the actual feat that's presented is hard to scale if at all. 


The context for the feat is that Invincible and a few others are outside the galaxy, and quickly race back via ship once some trouble shows up and they need to get home as fast as possible. This takes them a week via the ship method as shown, and thus you can form a calculation on how fast the ship is moving. Crossing 100,000 light-years in a week's time is 5,217,948 times faster than light. However, the calculation present instead gages Mark's potential speed via seeing how much faster he moved than the ship, which is…not the best logic all things considered.


First off, this feat is essentially calc stacking. For those unaware of what this is, it is essentially calculating something (power or speed or anything of the nature) and then formatting a different calculation off of it using those numbers. This is frowned upon in most cases in vs for obvious reasons; such as inflating calculations and feats far beyond the consistent feats of the franchise. This calculation gets Mark's speed through a calculation, which bases its numbers off the calculation of how fast the ship is. Ergo; calc stacking. 


Some may argue that due to its stated time to travel and distance, it could be used anyway due to somewhat stating how fast the ship is. However, even if you were to buy this logic, you'd then have to look at context and see why this doesn't make much sense. For one thing, Mark traveling nearly twenty times faster than the ship's top speed makes the need for him to use it nonsensical. He'd get there in less than 12 hours if this was the case, and even assuming this is ignored because they need a ship or some writing based reason, it's highly unlikely he actually outpaced the ships top speed. He left it to fly to earth when they were approaching the planet, and likely slowing down to do so. If they didn't, then they'd pass by or hit the planet in the time shown due to how fast they were going, and the distance Mark traveled to earth from the ship visibly being no interstellar distance. 


So, getting 4 billion × FTL is a calculation inflation due to stacking numbers, and even if you decided to buy this logic, Mark being that much faster at top speed would make the ship unnecessary and meaningless, with context further proving he didn't outrace its top speed due to it likely slowing down on the last stretches to earth.


The other questionable feat of this nature would be Invincible flying from a planet to the Coalition. This calculation is also skeptical at best due to the logic used. Per context, Mark flies to a planet the Coalition needed their best ships to reach. The calculation uses external reasoning from previous examples, like them crossing a galaxy, to say Mark traveled that equivalent in the timeframe of a few minutes. The problem here is it is never stated how much he actually flew, only that their best ships were needed to get there, and that can mean any number of things beyond assuming such a distance. It could mean literal stronger ships due to harsh conditions, strange phenomena only their best could handle, with the list going on and on. Even more support for this comes in the previous calculation, funnily enough, where Nolan outright says it will take the Coalition forces longer to get to earth than their own ship; you know, the one that crossed a galaxy in a week? Their best ships taking longer than usual due to not being solely focused on speed makes this feat reliant on extremely shaky logic that assumes the best possible result to get what it is, so it realistically shouldn't be used. 

Verdicts

Team Boros

Stats

Jumping right into things, stats are a rather interesting comparison in of itself. So, let's go with the easier route first, that being speed. Boros would naturally be leagues above lightspeed heroes like Flashy Flash and Genos, or his subordinate Geryuganshoop, who can throw objects at near lightspeed. Saitama defeated him extremely casually, reacting a few times FTL to do so, and Boros was far stronger than that even without Meteoric Burst. With it, and his several times boosted all-around stats, Boros would be dozens, maybe hundreds of times faster than that. However, it is extremely unlikely it he could outpace Battle Beast despite this, due to the speed at which the Viltrumites move through space. Omni-Man's example is the best and holds the most weight, topping out at 3.3 billion times faster than light. This is obviously much faster than Boros, so, point for Battle Beast, but this is the most he's getting in regards to speed.


One could argue Battle Beast to be even faster through other feats in Invincible, but virtually all of these can not be used as feats without extreme generosity or ignoring context. For example, getting Invincible's speed to billions…through calc stacking off a ship that was likely slowing down while nearing Earth. In a similar way with Invincible; his flight to another planet that the Coalition needed their best ships to get to. This feat in particular has no statement whatsoever of how far the distance is, so just assuming they meant another galaxy and Mark can travel there in minutes is pretty far-fetched at best. Not only does this place in an Imaginary distance, but also ignore that it took their nest ships longer than a week to reach Earth from that other galaxy earlier. So, both of Invincible’s speed feats do not work, and other examples of Eve or Thragg keeping up with objects that “cross the cosmos quickly” have no reference for timeframe or actual distance traveled. By that logic we could scale Boros to his ship crossing an unknown distance of the universe through his travels. But, Battle Beast is faster regardless thanks to Nolan's feat, so it turns to power for the overall tide of the battle. 


Both of them are at pretty much the top of their verse at the end of the day, and upscale from very similar feats. Various town to city calcs from low tier heroes and villains, and teraton to exaton ends for other high-tier feats, like Orochi absorbing a large section of the Earth's core, or Invincible moving one of Mars moons with the Tick, which actually gets near identical values funnily enough. At their best though, their battles have threatened entire planets, through Battle Beast scaling to the Viltrum planet bust, or Boros wielding planet busting power through his Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon. Due to the various arguments for both in power, I'll go over each of them to prove who is stronger, and why I think it would be Boros.


So, for Battle Beast, let's go over the arguments to surpass Boros, those being

  1. The Yottaton end of Mark's moon push

  2. Viltrumites destroying celestial bodies statements

  3. Potential Scaling to Null the planet eater

  4. And the elephant in the room, Omnipotus


Starting with the moon push, it getting yottatons at all ignores context and logic to get it that high. Essentially, the calculation is done through comparing the size of the moon to Mars in a far off shot, than using the mass of Mars moons as reference to get its weight and thus the kinetic energy to move it. The problem with that is this is basically making up a new moon to use for the feat, getting far higher results through doing so. We know the planet they are on is Mars, and therefore the moon was one of the 2 orbiting the planet. Therefore, those ends are what should be used; not an Imaginary moon. This is because it's obvious what the writer intended it to be (one of the planet's moons) and no artist can accurately draw celestial bodies in comparison to each other with their actual sizes in mind. That sort of thing is never at the forefront of their mindset, as it's already hard enough to draw these objects as big in comparison to the other objects in the scene. For example, in various cartoons, video games, and the like (Cuphead, Mario/Donkey Kong, Popeye, etc) the celestial objects are not drawn to “scientific” accuracy. They can appear to be only slightly away from Earth, or little bigger than the character in mind. So, do these universes just have celestial objects with these rules?


…no. That's unfounded and asinine. 


Unless otherwise stated the objects are different in size to account for a simple art error, we should take the real sizes of objects we can calculate. Doing so for the Mars moon move gets 70-180 exatons, and straps Battle Beast of a potential Yottaton feat. Moving on to Null, this feat is rather easy to Debunk. The main problem with it is we aren't given a timeframe for how long he does this, and little proof he actually absorbs the entire planet all at once. This would drastically change how much energy he actually absorbs, and nuke the feat entirely. In the same way, we can cover (sigh) Omnipotus.


This guy is pretty famous due to guidebook claims of destroying star systems and even a universe, which would FAR outclass Boros…if it were true. The statements may exist and likely hold weight, but therein lies the answer. It is not only mentioned that Omnipotus draws power on energy to get stronger, and mentioned he relied on Chain Reactions for his destruction. To that end, we have no time frame on his destruction of either feat, and can say the same result as Null when it comes to debunking his power. No time frame, and his absorbing energy to get stronger, means these high-tier feats are not attributable to Invincible Scaling, and this is further backed up by that mention of Chain Reactions. This proves that Omnipotus relied on other factors besides his actual stewngth to achieve this kind of power, and frankly, this makes sense for both feats. Both examples are VERY inconsistent with other power levels from the verse, and aren't supported in canon. 


For example, take the Viltrum planet bust, and other threats involving Celestial bodies, like Thragg's threat of 37 Viltrumites against the Earth or Robert Kirk's statement that Viltrumites can threaten Celestial Bodies. The fact that nearly 40 Viltrumites were needed for something like that is already a hole in claiming the top tiers are several dozen digits higher, and the Celestial Body statement supports moon or planet busting given we've seen characters do those sorts of things. No Viltrumite has any feats regarding as high as a star, and thus high-tier ends in that regard can be dismissed. In comparison with the Viltrum planet bust, and Thragg's own battle with Thokk being a planet level threat, all this evidence points to the top tiers of the verse making it to planet level, but anything beyond is unfounded highballs, unreasonable calculations, and assuming the absolute best in most scenarios. Now, let's compare this with Boros.


The big example here is that the Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon was outright stated to be a planet buster in the compass and anime, not just in relation to Earth, which is the least you could go with. With that in mind, Boros’ greatest move is already nearly twice as strong as Viltrum's when divided up for each contributor. Any result to push Viltrum higher would apply to Boros as well, as he was absolutely sure the planet would be destroyed. Combined with the statement that he can destroy planet(s), and we could likely boost numbers through using larger planets as a reference, boosting his overall power advantage even higher as a result. In the same way, if you wish to use higher end Invincible feats, we can do the same for Boros. We could scale him to Tatsumaki's moving Earth with over half a Yottaton through Awakened Garou, or take the star bust statement in the English compass and have him easily eclipse Battle Beast in power. Some may claim the statement is a mistranslation due to how the word for Star (Hoshi) is the same as planet. However, the guidebook accurately translates the name in his very attack and its effects on 3 separate occasions, and it's highly unlikely they messed up here. Even if you were to ignore it, you'd still have his Scaling to Tatsumaki, which is over 20 times stronger than what Invincible or Omni-Man could pull off when destroying Viltrum. 


All in all, when comparing their stats, Battle Beast may be faster, but Boros is far stronger with his best move, and more than capable of killing him with it. All ends to make Battle Beast stronger simply do not work, and any attempt to buy these would allow much more concrete examples on Boros’ side to take the stage and further the gap with similar levity

Abilities/Arsenal

Moving to their powers and weapons, both hold decent edges in both categories. Battle Beast has far more weapons, like a teleporter and his many Gladiator style tools, while Boros has leagues better abilities; primarily, endurance. While Battle Beast has statements of “unlimited” stamina, and has fought for far longer than Boros at his best strength, you have to consider what endurance ultimately means here. While Thokk can push past ridiculous amounts of pain and injury, he can't actually heal it, and this doesn't save him from the actual damage. Extensive damage to his heart will also just permanently end him, and he has no means to come back from something like this, but Boros does. His healing abilities are so absurd he can come back from paste while running out of fuel, and this means none of Battle Beast's attacks can actually end him before he uses his trump card.


The physical boosts Boros gets from Meteoric Burst lend far greater mobility and maneuverability, and his vast array of energy attacks let him battle from a distance. Even if Battle Beast got in close, it still wouldn't help him overtax the Regeneration of Boros. While he did run out of energy against Saitama in a relatively short time, this was due to Saitama being far stronger and not fighting him on similar footing. Against Battle Beast, who is not nearly strong enough to overwhelm him physically, this won't really matter all that much. In the same vein, both could keep track of each other due to sensing (physical or energy) but Boros had a more impressive reach in that regard due to sensing strength, and it would likely lead to his finding where to strike hardest. Basically, Arsenal goes to Battle Beast, but abilities go to Boros. 

Tertiary

Finally in Tertiary matters, this yet again leans Boros. Both have years of experience and skill in slaughter across the universe, and are nearly unmatched in combat. However, while Battle Beast has plenty of weapons, none of these can not bypass his healing factor,  and all can be blasted away by techniques like Energy Bullet. In that vein, Boros's healing and AOE make Battle Beast pressed to actually damage him beyond what he can come back from, and his massive attacks make superior speed not much of an advantage in the long run. Finally, let's turn to the Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon. Not only would this destroy the planet they were fighting on, but leave Battle Beast stranded in space with critical wounds. He has shown he can survive something like a vacuum, but even then he had to rely on assistance from others, and not when he had a gaping hole in his chest. Remember, destroying Thokk's heart is something he can't push past, and he can't exactly dodge a planet exploding in his face either. Both results would end in Battle Beast either dead or dying from the blast, and neither would be something he could reliably escape from. 


To explain a little more, a large of point of Thokk’s character is that he wishes to die to a worthy adversary in the glory of battle. To that end, he refuses to take advantages or shortcuts against foes, as proven when he dueled Thragg; slicing his own guts open when put at an advantage due to interference. Thus, there's no way he'd use his teleporter or ship to escape, or run away other than face it head-on, which would lead to the end he is searching for. Also, realistically speaking, dying to an alien giving it his all to destroy you and the planet in a massive energy attack is one of the most hype ways you could go out lol.

Conclusion

In conclusion, Boros has exactly what he needs to triumph here. His maximum power and AOE are MORE than enough to critically damage or outright kill Thokk, with both results leaving him to die in space. His area control through energy blasts and maneuverability, when combined with his unparalleled healing, make Battle Beasts weapons and tools fairly inconsequential in comparison; same with his endurance. All of this results in Thokk finally meeting his worthy opponent and the end that comes with it, in a Battle that will be legendary for generations to come. 


The winner…is Lord Boros.

Team Battle Beast

Stats

The stats here are very dependent on your own interpretation and opinions. However we here on Team Battle Beast we buy higher end scaling. To start, Battle Beast is at least Small Planet level by surviving the explosion of Viltrum worth 27 Zettatons of TNT. This should be around the same tier as Boros is stated to be able to blast away planets using the CSRC. However, this is only half of the story for AP/Durability, as we need to discuss scaling. Battle Beast should easily scale around the power of Tech Jacket, who kept up with Null. Null took out the Planet Eater. Who at minimum is Planet Level for obvious reasons, but at maximum can be getting into the Small Star ranges via converting the planet into energy for itself to grow stronger (if you buy it of course). But this isn't even the full power of scaling Battle Beast can obtain. Battle Beast has the most obvious scaling chain from Dinosaurus to Omnipotus. As while Dinosaurus's teeth couldn't pierce through Thragg’s head, Battle Beast's could. This should allow Battle Beast to easily scale to Omnipotus. Who can destroy and absorb a star system and even a whole Universe. This is way above any power Boros could reasonably scale to even if you buy the star busting statement which is likely a mistranslation. Otherwise Boros's best feat is scaling to Tatsumaki, who could move earth out of our Solar System. This gets a whopping 640.3 Zettatons of TNT. Not bad, but even just lowballing Omnipotus's absorption to only absorbing a star's worth of energy, that still gets 1787 Foe. To say the least, this makes Battle Beast way stronger.


And Battle Beast is also way faster. Boros can scale to speed feats that get 4.35c at most, but Battle Beast can scale to Omni-Man flying to Thraxa in the Virgo Supercluster, which is 3,389,285,714.29c. This means Battle Beast is 779146141.216 TIMES FASTER THAN BOROS! With both the AP and Strength difference bought by our team, Boros couldn't touch nor hurt Battle Beast to any significant degree.

Abilities/Arsenal 

This section isn't very great for either. Both combatants have certain weapons and special abilities but most of them are unimportant to the actual debate. Boros likely has a better ship, Battle Beast has more weapons and even his teleporter… however he likely isn't to use it in combat as it's really only shown as a to-and-from type device and would likely not use it as it wouldn't be in character. Other than that most of Boros would likely edge out this section with the use of two abilities but Battle Beast should be able to get around them.


Admittedly Boros has extremely impressive regeneration. Battle Beast will struggle to kill Boros in a single strike for sure. However, because of Battle Beast's stat advantage, BB can quickly drain Boros of his energy by making him constantly regenerate. Activating Meteoric Burst and CSRC speed this up even quicker leaving Boros unable to regenerate. This is shown off during Boros's fight with Saitama as his use of the CSRC leaves him completely unable to regenerate or move as he has expended all his energy.


Speaking of the Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon, It's Boros's other biggest tool in this fight. An attack that can blow up a planet is quite helpful against someone who can't breathe in space naturally. To discuss why this wouldn't be a sure fire wincon, we need to move to the Tertiary section.

Tertiary

Now, the main argument for the CSRC netting Boros the win is by either killing Battle Beast/leaving him to float in space. However this assumes Battle Beast would not attempt to match the cannon and overpower it like Saitama did in OPM. “But Battle Beast wants a glorious death, so he would let himself get hit by it” you may be saying. However, this is a complete and utter misunderstanding of what Battle Beast wants in his glorious death. Since Battle Beast did canonically die we actually can say he got his death and what we wanted out of it.


Now how did Battle Beast die? Was it by a single attack finishing him off? Nope, Battle Beast fought a grueling multiple day battle against Thragg until a winner was decided. Battle Beast is also not one to just give up mid fight, so why would he let himself get hit by an attack. He fought Thragg for multiple days evenly before his death and based on said death, he wants to die in a long, hard earned battle where both fighters are pushed to their limits. But with BB’s stat advantage he's likely just going to continuously beat Boros until he uses the CSRC. From here Battle Beast has no reason to accept his death because he is still in great fighting condition, so he will likely just attempt to match the attack and with his strength, overpower the cannon.


While we are on the topic of the Thragg fight, many people may claim Battle Beast would damage himself to make his fight even with Boros. This is not how Battle Beast usually fights. Think in his fight against the Guardians. He didn't stick around when he was beating them to make the fight fair. Battle Beast left because he was stomping them too easily. The reason Battle Beast damaged himself was because the fight had not begun, and he already knew Thragg would be a worthy opponent. When the fight starts Boros would not be injured and Battle Beast wouldn't attempt to harm himself due to Boros's armor because 1. He wouldn't know the armor restrains Borors and 2. Even if he did, he could easily break the armor for Boros instead of harming himself. He hurt himself for Thragg to make the starting terms of the fight even and so because there was very little other ways to make it fair other than harming himself. 


Other than Battle Beast's mindset he should be more skilled and have a higher amount of stamina to pull from seeing as Boros has limited energy to pull from while Battle Beast has seemingly infinite stamina.

Conclusion

In conclusion Battle Beast should take this with relative ease. His equal-superior strength, much faster speed, better skill and lack of an energy limit can overwhelm Boros and his regeneration. His lust for a proper death will not hinder him in a fight on this level, and he Boros is just not likely to be a challenge worthy enough for him to tank an attack from that would defeat him in a way that goes against his death. How glorious is slowly drifting and getting frozen in space? The winner is Thokk, the Battle Beast.

Advantages and Disadvantages

Boros


Advantages:

  • Potentially stronger with certain ends

  • Battle Beast's wish for a good fight and death could backfire

  • Better abilities and is more versatile in that regard

  • Could nuke the planet, likely ending the fight if pulled off

  • Better ship

  • Has one of the hardest attack names in all of fiction


Equal:

  • Is coming back

  • No screen time


Disadvantages:

  • Slower by a wide margin

  • Potentially weaker

  • Limited by energy limit

  • Virtually no arsenal

  • Could have his CSRC matched by Battle Beast if he doesn't let his wish for a death go to his head

  • Bro lost his one on screen fight


Battle Beast

Advantages:

  • Likely relative in strength or stronger

  • Faster

  • More experience and skill

  • More weapons to increase versatility 

  • Not limited by energy

  • W Rizz


Equal:

  • Is coming back

  • No screen time


Disadvantages:

  • Potentially weaker

  • No way to bypass regeneration 

  • Could potentially die to the CSRC if It destroys the planet

  • Less abilities that are also less useful

  • Threw the bag and lost his ones

Votes

Team Boros: [1] (Round 1 Fight)

Team Battle Beast: [7] (Tru, Boomer, Rina, Z1, Hippo, Asura, Saul, Why am I here)

Boros's power and regeneration could keep up for a time, but eventually it all collapsed. The winner is Battle Beast.

Thank You/Next Time

Oh boy this was a wild one. Invincible stats are always a pain to talk about but I think we gave a pretty balanced take on them. Shout out to Asura, Round 1 and Boomer for ending up as high tier contributors. Everyone else put in their fair share but these few really helped in discussion. Not much to say other than thank you for reading. Now watch as we bring a wild next time to you in the form of…







Knight VS Samurai

Yeah were you expecting a real life MU? I THINK NOT! This blog is gonna be wild so stay tuned to see what fun stuff we got coming up for this blog. As usual you can DM me at tru2678 on Discord if you would like to join yourself


Thanks for reading!

Comments

  1. Joaquin Torres BautistaMay 7, 2024 at 7:55 PM

    I assume you guys are using folklore stuff for both the Knight and Samurai

    ReplyDelete

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